Listen With Others

Blogs by Setters and Solvers of the Listener Crossword

Archive for the ‘Solving Blogs’ Category

Fruitful Recipe by Dipper,

Posted by shirleycurran on 27 January 2012

Darn it, foiled again! There is substantial stress involved in attempting to solve all 53 Listener Crosswords in a year and hoping to get most of them right (yippee – only 52 this year! One chance fewer of bungling). For the second year running, I decided that a deliberate error in the first (like SOWE SPROUTS!) would kill the Listener demon. Then what appears? Such a gentle puzzle that another couple of hundred potential solvers will be hooked from the start and the old hands can’t kick the habit – not till next week anyway. (Isn’t that what New Year resolutions are all about?)

We couldn’t fill the grid fast enough with not a single moan about the clues. There wasn’t even the usual Listener compiler outpouring of alcohol, just Dipper’s habitual plants, asparagus, fruit, shrubbery, stumps and umbels.

We were briefly flummoxed by ‘Lambs very poor in Arizona wolf up with any local asparagus (7)’ and as, by this time, we had spotted the book title and author, … MANURING, SOWING, PLANTING OF KITCHEN GARDENS by the sixteenth century horticulturalist ROBERT GARDINER, we knew that we were looking for an extra word that began with A. Arizona seemed to stand out. Of course, that was to justify the LOBO< that went before ARY (‘any’ in local parlance) for OBOLARY, since LOBO is US usage.

Our other hiccup was uncertainty about 1ac, ‘Shrill noise, according to Scots, made by most of stuff I installed in Motherwell school (7). We had SCR?IC? and a wonderful range of potential Scottish screeches (skraich and screich being the most viable) but had to be really careful about that wordplay. We decided we were going to put CRA[m] I into SCH and count Motherwell as our extra letter rather than a Scots indicator (sneaky, Mr Dipper).

There was an intriguing clue at 33ac. ‘Heartless Welshman injures terrapin (4)’ I’m no terrapin expert, my expertise stops short at our special variety of fire-bellied toad (not actually toads at all, a different variety, the bombina variegata), at natrix natrix - grass-snakes, newts and the Jura vipers we have in the garden in the heat of the summer. However, EMYS had to be the answer when we removed the R from Emrys, the Welshman.

Why intriguing? Well, can you find Emrys in the 2011 Large Vermilion Volume? Officially, Dipper’s crossword was the first to be using the new Chambers Dictionary. Are the kind editors of the Listener crossword tipping us a wink that we can go on using that lovely list of names that was in the appendices of the previous versions (and not even add a disclaimer to that effect!) I do hope so.

Finished in a little over an hour; almost our record time. The exhortation to SOWE CARRETS (with its quaint spelling) was just where it ought to be to render life easy – right down that diagonal. So thank you Dipper for a gentle opener to 2012. I even had time left to cook dinner and draw a few carrots, with a couple of sprouts thrown in for post-Christmas cheer (well, cheer anyway that I don’t have to smell the horrid things for another year).

Posted in Solving Blogs | Tagged: , , | 1 Comment »

Listener 4170: Aristocat by Mango – A Setters’ Blog

Posted by Listen With Others on 21 January 2012

Mango consists of three people: Steve Mann (who is our founder and over the years has had most of the original ideas), John Guiver, and myself. On 2nd June 2007 — the day Initials by Mango was published in The Listener series — Steve emailed John and me (we do everything via email, with the three of us using distinct colours to avoid confusion) outlining his ideas for Mango #30, based on two Duke Ellington quotations, with Aristocats being the puzzle’s title.

His draft preamble and postamble ran as follows:

One word in each down clue requires a shift to a markedly different position before the clue can be solved. Initial letters of these words give a treated lyric (in ODQ6) that describes each down clue’s initial state. It may assist the solver if the answers to asterisked clues [19a, 30a, 12d, 16d, 18d, 20d, 21d] are entered first, with the assumption that a four-letter word has already been entered. The composer of the lyric’s score can then appear illegally. This and all clued entries are counter to a quotation indicated by two unclued entries [1a and 41a]. The composer’s thematic score appears appropriately positioned; solvers must write this (6, 4) beneath the grid and highlight two letters that are doubly relevant. Two down answers [ABIES at 5d, SHINE at 32d] must be scrambled before entry to complete a trio. Chambers Dictionary (2003) is the primary reference.

The last word in each down clue has to move to the front (make ‘a shift to a markedly different position’, or ‘swing’) before the clue can be solved and the surface reading makes sense. Initial letters of these words give “It don’t mean a thing / If it ain’t got that swing” with no vowels. 1a and 41a indicate a quote from Duke Ellington: “Playing ‘Bop’ is like scrabble with all the vowels missing”. LING was the first word entered in a normal game of Scrabble, followed by answers to asterisked clues, allowing Duke to appear illegally (names are not allowed) at 25 across, and scoring twenty five points, with KT (Knight) scoring double. (Count) BASIE and (Earl) HINES complete the trio of aristocratic jazzmen.

Listener 4170 Setters Grid A

With his customary attention to detail, Steve noted that 1a and 41 were overunched, and also listed the pieces in a normal Scrabble set, which we needed later.

I suggested a few improvements to the grid and also suggested Aristocat as the title (ditching Basie and Hines), and John thought that we should “evolve the Scrabble game a bit more”. After much further discussion of numerous ideas, we eventually settled on:

In all but seven clues a letter must either drop out [vowels] or move left/right [consonants] before the clue can be solved (the surface reading often suffers); these letters reveal a quotation in ODQ6. Two answers clued without definition form the first part of another thematic quotation, also in ODQ6. They and the answers to the seven clues referred to above must be entered in accordance with the rest of the quotation. Solvers must finally highlight those seven entries [which include every consonant, including the consonantal Y, in YRDNG]. Numbers after clues refer to the entry length. Chambers Dictionary (2003) is the primary reference.

And John produced the following fill, which formed the basis of the final version:

This all sounds very straightforward, but it actually took us almost a year before we reached agreement.

We then set about writing the clues. As usual, Steve allotted each of us one third of the clues, and created a template document into which we were to write our efforts, each in his own colour (mine being red). We then said of each other’s clues either “That is brilliant” or “Maybe this would be better” or “Total rethink needed” or whatever. Emails flashed back and forth, and eleven successive versions of the clues document appeared, but eventually we reached agreement, after about only one month, in fact.

Aristocat was the last Listener using Chambers 2008 as the primary reference. We were relieved that we squeezed in just before the switch to Chambers 2011. Otherwise two of our clues (22a and 20d) might not have been allowed, as they relied on a 2008 appendix to verify that NANCY is a diminutive of AGNES and AGNES means CHASTE.

We wonder how many solvers will have noticed that it is only vowels that drop out from the clues, only consonants that move left/right. How many will have noticed that the highlighted entries represent a vowel-free game of Scrabble (involving every consonant at least once). How many will have enjoyed the puzzle (we have in fact peeped at AnswerBank and so feel quite confident on that score).

Roddy Forman (one third of Mango).

P.S. We are of course mortified that the clue to 42a failed to indicate two words, in spite of our having spotted a similar error in 23d. A friend has asked why on earth we did not have the puzzle test-solved, when the error would surely have been corrected. Mango has only once had a puzzle test-solved, I think, for a special reason that I cannot now remember. Curiously enough, though, Steve did at the last minute suggest that maybe we should send Aristocat to a test-solver, but I argued that a team of three, not to mention two editors, had no need to bother anyone else. Wrong again, Mr Forman!
 

Posted in Solving Blogs | Leave a Comment »

Aristocat by Mango – not quite QWIJIBO

Posted by shirleycurran on 20 January 2012

Mango! What a pleasant surprise for the last day of the year and our 53rd Listener. We’ve managed to complete them all (though with what success I dare not guess as I rarely consult the solutions – though I did, last week and was disconcerted to see that CARNELIANS was in the original Times Website publication and in the following day’s newspaper, when CORNELIANS was clearly the correct answer). With the able Mango team at the helm, this promised to be fair and fun. And it was!

But it wasn’t easy! As usual, the numpties began in the south-east corner and, with SWEIR (‘So damn lazy up north (5)’) understood what was going on. The N was moving to give me a ‘sweir’ S(on) and the ‘dam’ was the weir. That was subtle enough and there were anther 42 of these little word games to complete! Ouf!  What a clever and original idea, though. I have seen the misprint device used, so that Mangled (anagram indicator), for example, becomes Dangled, but the idea of having every clue move a letter left or right, or omit one, with so many examples of word-play indicators being part of the device was delightfully novel and challenging.

We had ‘Toiled’ losing a T to give us ‘oiled’, ‘Violet’ gaining an L to be ‘violent’ (interesting that the capital letter was allowed to just disappear there!), ‘writing’ gaining an H and ‘writhing’, ‘angling’ becoming ‘tangling’, as well as ‘rap’ becoming a container indicator ‘wrap’. Part of the subtlety was that these were hidden among other tricky moves like ‘ruins’ simply losing its I to become the R of R(uns) and one I particularly enjoyed ‘Grant and Charley, on vacation, chase girl (22, diminutive)’. I didn’t know that Nancy was a diminutive of Agnes (a chaste girl), but liked the way that the randy couple of men became a simple ‘gran’ or ‘nan’ and C(harle)y on holiday with a pure lassie.

I could go on admiring these fine clues – but you solved them for yourself so move on! The p.d.m. came early when I fed my few letters of 24 ac into Antony Lewis’s Crossword Compiler word-finder and Duke Ellington appeared as one of about ten offerings. The ODQ gave him only one quotation: ‘Playing bop is like Scrabble with all the vowels missing’. What compiler could resist that temptation! (One has confessed to me that he has been working on exactly the same theme, prompted by that quotation – well, Mango preempted.)

From there I was on the home straight (but had to gallop for about three more hours!) 1ac had been an awkward PLYN?B?S and 42 L?S?RBBL. Well, I ask you! With them and Duke Ellington in place, difficult areas of the grid became easier, though I have never heard of YARDANG, JAPAN WAX, DISCOVERTURE or XEMA - more words to nonchalantly slip into conversation next week.

Of course Mango had the usual Listener Compiler healthy dose of alcohol. We had ‘Scotch or gin taken till mellow’ – though sadly it turned into a Scotch Tor – a  BEN, the gin drinker was ‘taken ill’ IGN giving us BENIGN. The ‘society crowd in 42ac were drinking ‘cold gin’ and a ‘pint’ in 10d turned into a ‘pin’ – a mere AXLE (Take = R after W in WRAXLE, ‘fight over maT in Devon). Is it that crossword compilers like their tipple, or just that the words for alcohol lend themselves so readily to crossword use?

So what was it all about? I highlighted my seven words that had no vowels and wondered about the other quotation that had appeared: ‘It don’t mean a thing, if it ain’t got that swing.’ I imagine we weren’t supposed to be solving backwards (as we invariably do) and working from Duke Ellington to the quotation. The quotation was intended to lead us to him.

What was the point of all those words without vowels spreading out from the L of ELLINGTON? Aaah, SCRABBLE! Brilliant play! Mango have the X and Y in triple word-score positions. It was a friend who later pointed out to me that, just like Scrabble, this was pangrammatic (minus the vowels, in Duke Ellington Bop mode). Lovely! (But what a good thing that there wasn’t a space below the grid where we had to enter the total score in points of those vowel-less words, or even send our entries on an appropriately coloured grid.)

Thank you Mango for a fine last 2011 crossword.

Posted in Solving Blogs | Tagged: | 4 Comments »

Listener 4170: Mango’s Aristocat (or Is He in Debrett’s?)

Posted by Listen With Others on 20 January 2012

For those of you that don’t know, Mango is not an individual, but an occasional collaboration between Radix, Seth Mould and Shackleton. Given this pedigree, it’s safe to say that you can expect a fairly tough and very entertaining puzzle. Their last was City Tour back in 2008, its theme being the Tower of Hanoi puzzle. It was a superb puzzle, just predating my LWO activities.

Here we had the last Listener of 2011, and the last using Chambers (2008) as primary reference before (2011) takes over. Personally, I was still trying to catch up with puzzle solving after the Christmas and New Year festivities, which invariably leave me tired and zonked out (OK … blotto, if you must)! As a result, it was the second Sunday after publication before I started Aristocat, and I prayed that there wouldn’t be any tricky engame to beguile me. There was an interesting clueing device in all but seven clues: one letter had to be omitted or alternatively moved to the left or right before solving. I was sure that I’d come across this latter technique before, but wasn’t sure where. Knowing the fixation that at least one of the triumvirate had with symmetry, I laid odds with myself that there would be twelve of each type of letter movement (left, right or out).

Listener 4170Little did I realise how difficult the clues would be. After all, it was not obvious whether one or two words in a particular clue would be affected. If two words, then the whole ‘sense’ of the clue could change, and I felt that my brain was being deliberately messed with! This was borne out by my first pass through the clues. The acrosses revealed only 14 ETERNAL, 27 EATHE and 39 LAMAIST. The downs started well with 1 PRECLUDE and 3 YRENT, but despite seeing likely letters that needed dropping or moving, that was it. I wasn’t really surprised to see that the few that I solved all involved omissions, and thus just one word changing in their clues.

With the help of 1dn, however, things started moving a bit more smoothly. 21ac was my first clue requiring the movement of a letter: Posh oven returned to base for mother, although it was a sneaky liittle movement, with the M just hopping across the space before it to form other. Still, at least I had a left moving letter, and we were told in the preamble that movements would alternate direction.

19ac Sedate Queen, unwell, in train broken down on outskirts of Zaire (7) was irking me. I kept trying to fit TZARINA to the wordplay, and although TRAIN was there, Zaire was not ZA, and there was no sedate or seated monarch to be found. It wasn’t Bradford’s that came to the rescue, but Chambers Crossword Dictionary. Although I sometimes find the division of words into letter lengths useful (here I was looking for a 7-letter word), in this case it wasn’t. Luckily my eyes wandered a bit and I saw TRANQUILLIZE further down with QU and ILL in the middle. What a stroke of luck! Except that there was now a 12-letter word, obviously thematic, to fit into an entry of only seven spaces. A few minutes later, I finally doodled with ruin left ten at 9dn and up popped INTERFLUENT. These two crossing entries made me feel fairly certain that only the consonants were to be entered; NTRFLNT and TRNQLLZE. But that was thematic how?

Well, the downhill ski to the finish was on, except that those of you who’ve seen me on skis will realise that I’m only a red-runner. In any event, about 5 hours after starting, all the pieces were eventually in place.

The central entry was DUKE ELLINGTON, the aristoc[r]at of the title. The only quotation from him in my ODQ (luckily I have one of the two editions mentioned in the preamble) is Playing ‘Bop’ is like scrabble with all the vowels missing. There is also a reference there to Mills where what is spelt out by the naughty letters in the clues can be found: It don’t mean a thing If it ain’t got that swing (the slang, and lack of jazz knowledge, hindered me for a long time). The music for this 1942 song was written by Duke Ellington.

Listener 4170 My EntryAs the lyrics hinted, the vowels were to be omitted from the thematic entries (symmetrically placed, of course), as they were from PLAYING BOP at 1ac and LIKE SCRABBLE at 42ac, the two clues without definition. It had taken me a bit of time to realise that these last entries were not simple phrases straight from the dictionary. Finally, there weren’t twelve of each type of letter movement as I had surmised at the beginning. Instead, and also thematically, it was the vowels that were dropped and the consonants which moved left or right.

Well, I may not have been right about that last point, but I was certainly right about it being a tough, fair and delightful puzzle. Great fun, guys. And among many fine clues, my favourite:

40ac   So damn lazy up north (5)   (which should read Son dam lazy up north, to give SWEIR)!

Political correctness doesn’t even come close!

 

Posted in Solving Blogs | 2 Comments »

Seaside Shuffle by Monk

Posted by shirleycurran on 13 January 2012

“Christmas Eve, almost, and last week’s was tough so surely they will give us a gentle thirty-minute romp this week.” I happily downloaded this one and smiled. Just a compact preamble, a mere 32 clues, an unusual reference book required, The Oxford Treasury of Sayings and Quotations, and four unclued lights. Lovely!

There was that mildly disconcerting word ‘transpositions’, but, at least it didn’t say ‘Jumbles’ so we shelved that anxiety. Hmmmm!

It was a partying night anyway so the numpties happily solved a few long clues – ‘Black dog mainly after huge bird that’s stalked (8)’ Well, that has to be B + ROC + COLLI(E) and that will give us an extra L. (At least it wasn’t Brussels Sprouts – Oh dear, that’s tomorrow!) ‘Dog bark, say, lifted tail (9)’ RIND with EG< and BACK gives us RIDGEBACK with an extra N. ‘Poltergeist almost shocking old composer (9)’ That has to be an anagram of PERGOLESI with T extra (I love his Stabat Mater – rather Easter than Christmas, as was the ‘Horse, at first sight rather old, died in festival (8)’ R(ather) O EASTER round D = ROADSTER producing E).

Another easy anagram gave us INDISCRETE,  ’Homogenous work isn’t recited (10)’ and another spare T. We teased out CORNED BEEF from ‘Jailbird and hooligan quarrel about rule that’s preserved (10, 2 words)’  – producing an N from the CON and NED – and lots of shorter words, and shrugged our shoulders when none of these intersected convincingly with each other. Party time.

It was after midnight when I took another look. We had a vaguely coherent extra letter message: ?LL TH? RI?HT ?OTE?S ?UT NO? IN THE RIGZT ……… (Yes, I know now that BELIZE is both BZ and BH – what useful things we Listener solvers ingest, as well as Monk’s healthy sprinkling of wine. He lived up to the Listener compiler tradition with the SOAVE, the ‘cultivated wine in Belize, and the Chief magistrate drinking a lot of ale – even if the wine bar in 4d stayed closed. There was a surprising presence of dogs too!)

That message was familiar. It was Eric Morecambe’s response to Andre Previn, wasn’t it? It boded ill. I jumped to the flawed post-party conclusion that we had to move do, re, mi etc. to the end of clues, or something like that. The prospect was daunting. ORDER, the last word of the quotation, would give a DO and a RE, but so what? REDOR, DORER, EREDO?

Fortunately light dawned in the morning and I understood that all the letters except ABCDEF and G could stay in their preordained positions, but that every word save one, had to have shifted notes. The one was clearly PREVIN as he had only an E. Grid filling was underway. But what a task! So much for my gentle Christmas treat!

The biggest problem was, of course, the missing clues. It is easy to write all the potential letters, squeezed into each vacant square, and eliminate them as they are used elsewhere in the word, but this system falls down when you haven’t solved a clue. We had several we hadn’t solved. I now know that IBEX has a plural IBICES, that there was a star eighties and nineties football player called BARNES and that AMEN CORNER was a fifties somewhat oxmoronic ‘famous Welsh rock band’. Even ARROGANCE had me stumped for a while – ‘Side’ indeed!

I think DOGBEE was the toughest clue of all, but when I commented to a friend who had finished this one long before me, he said “Well, yes, it was tough, but what do you expect? It is the Listener after all!” Well, I have already told you what I expected – a gentle Christmas treat – so I had to produce my own. Thank you, Monk!

Posted in Solving Blogs | Tagged: | Leave a Comment »

 
Follow

Get every new post delivered to your Inbox.