Listen With Others

Are you sitting comfortably? Then we’ll begin

Listener 4811 “Southern Course”: A Setter’s Blog by Seps

Posted by Listen With Others on 5 May 2024

This was my first attempt at a themed puzzle. I finished my previous job in June 2022 and my new (self-employed) career was starting slowly, so I had some spare time and decided to have a go. 

Soon after I started solving the Listener in 1993 I encountered a memorable puzzle called ‘Not Quite Tied Test’ by Phil Brindall (no. 3216) in which the clues were cricket-themed. These days golf is the sport I’m most passionate about (or, more accurately, obsessed with), hence the golf-themed puzzle. When I noticed that GENE SARAZEN and ANCIENT MARINER had a few letters in common as well as the albatross connection, that gave me the main gimmick.

I needed a few more thematic pieces. Once I started thinking about the Ancient Mariner, the line ‘And he stoppeth one of three’ seemed useful. (I’m not sure who first used this line to describe a substandard wicketkeeper, but it’s been part of cricket lore for a while.) And the other reference to an albatross that jumped to mind was the Monty Python sketch.

All the thematic elements seemed to suggest themselves quite quickly, but I came down to earth with a bump when it came to fitting them into a grid. After dozens of abortive attempts, moving them round the grid, changing orientation, re-barring etc, I eventually had a filled grid and was able to start writing clues. This part was really enjoyable. I sent the puzzle off to Filbert who kindly agreed to test solve.

This revealed one major problem: my answer lengths were much too short. There was no alternative but to improve the grid and re-fill. I had to remove the grid’s symmetry but found an alternative that seemed to meet the average word length requirement. Most of the original clues had to go, including references to (among others) Bobby Jones, Sandy Lyle, Angel Cabrera, Craig Stadler, Nick Faldo, Ben Hogan, Hideki Matsuyama, Billy Casper, Patrick Reed, Fuzzy Zoeller, Adam Scott, Arnold Palmer, Horton Smith and Greg Norman. But I was happy enough with the new set of clues.

I sent the puzzle off to Shane, only to find the average answer length was still a bit too short – I had made the mistake of rounding to one decimal place! But I was able to fix this with relatively minor changes to the grid and a few new clues. It was great to receive the email from Shane accepting the puzzle. There was already a puzzle scheduled for Masters Saturday in 2023 so we decided to hold it over until 2024.

When I received the edited puzzle for proof-reading, it was clear my original clues were rather on the long side. However, Shane and Roger had come up with some excellent concise alternatives including new references to Jon Rahm and Byron Nelson.

I learned a lot from this process, in particular to be patient when constructing a grid, to nail down the grid before writing the clues and to keep the clues concise. 

Thanks to my test solver Filbert, to Shane and Roger, and to John Green for his sterling work.

Posted in Setting Blogs | Leave a Comment »

Listener No 4811: “Southern Course” by Seps

Posted by Dave Hennings on 3 May 2024

Seps is a relative newcomer to Listener world. Indeed his first outing here was just after Christmas last year, an uncommonly short time between puzzles. That puzzle (no. 4796, Delay Repay) was based on the betting con. in the 1973 film, The Sting. Even though I’m a keen golfer, it didn’t register that this week’s title would have a golfing connection… even though the puzzle appeared on the Saturday of Masters week. [That’s one of the four Majors for those of you who are not golfers. Ed.]

Here we had most clues with misprints in the definition and then a lot of endgame jiggery-pokery some way down the line. The golfing theme soon became obvious with 1ac mentioning Augusta, 6ac Seve (Ballesteros) and 13ac (Jack) Nicklaus. (Ian) Woosnam, Sandy (Lyle) and Nick (Faldo) represented Britain further on.

Needless to say, I had great fun disentangling the golfers from crossword clues, although it was by no means straightforward. The corrected misprints were to reveal a description and a phrase from a quotation. These were Famously shot an albatross and Stoppeth one of three. The latter I knew to be from Coleridge’s The Rime of the Ancient Mariner, but I needed Golfipedia to reveal that it was Gene Sarazen who “famously” scored the first albatross in the Masters in 1935 on the 15th hole. It would be another 32 years before the next.

It didn’t take long to see GENE SARAZEN in rows 7 and 8 of the grid and that changing 6 letters would give ANCIENT MARINER who also shot an albatross. Finally, we had to change three entries to “reveal a group and highlight a representation of a thematic alternative”. Knocking out the third letter in each of three down clues (MOUNT, PYOT, HORN) revealed MONTY PYTHON at the top of the last two columns.

Ok, so I may not have been around for Sarazen’s albatross, nor indeed for the first edition of Coleridge’s poem, but I do remember the Monty Python sketch where the cinema interval sales ”lady” sold sea birds rather than ice cream! I also remember an alternative, or at least I thought I did, and spent a few minutes looking for a stormy petrel on a stick! This was in fact an alternative alternative to the GANNET in column 1.

Thanks, Seps, for helping me enjoy some golf from the comfort of my armchair, especially since the weather has been pretty miserable of late.

Posted in Solving Blogs | Tagged: , | Leave a Comment »

Listener 4811: Southern Course by Seps

Posted by vaganslistener on 3 May 2024

This was a lovely layered puzzle which gave nothing away at first but slowly revealed itself as a three-fold play on “Albatross” – the Ancient Mariner (who STOPPETH ONE OF THREE as per the down message), Gene Sarazen, who FAMOUSLY SHOT AN ALBATROSS (the across message) in another sense (a double eagle) as a young golfer, but had to give way in the grid to the Ancient Mariner, and the Monty Python sketch “Albatross” with its GANNET on A STICK.

I found the clues fair and pretty straightforward, with some clever touches, not least in the way in which misprints and golfing references were both incorporated into them. It must have been fun if a bit of a headache to write them. 

The only real problem I encountered was how to “alter” the answers to the three normal clues (9, 10 and 19d) to produce the necessary MONTY PYTHON. You’ll see from the pencil marks that I’ve left in for now that my first instinct was to anagram the words. That leaves all the squares filled but not all with real words. The alternative, which I’ve plumped for, is the deletion of a letter in each word, leaving awkward gaps but all real words as long as one reads MONTY and PYTHON with their spaces as such. Since the preamble neither indicates that all real words will be left nor that the spaces must be ignored, I can’t see how either approach can be marked wrong; but since the “real words” condition is so common, I’ve run with that. 

A great puzzle, Seps, and I hope we will see more from you. But why a second one now so soon after the other (not that I’m complaining)? Ah: Wiki tells me that Sarazen shot his albatross in the Masters on April 18th1935. I wonder how many of us knew that.

PS The notes at http://www.listenercrossword.com tell us that the puzzle was published during this year’s Masters Tournament (naturally).

PPS The solution I went for is the one published. The notes say that “Three grid entries have their third letter erased, revealing MONTY PYTHON” and perhaps hint at a connection with “stoppeth one of three”, which hadn’t occurred to me.

Posted in Solving Blogs | Leave a Comment »

Listener 4811 Southern Course by Seps

Posted by gillwinchcombe on 3 May 2024

Southern Course – or should that be curse?* leaps to the top of my gelasticity leader board for reprising the ridiculous Monty Python sketch and giving me a good laugh.

Or rather, laughs because I had to watch several versions (including one very rude one) in order to be sure I’d alighted on the right answer.

So I’ll happily forgive you Seps for sending me on a protracted wild-albatross chase listening to Iron Maiden’s Ancient Mariner (better than I remembered) and countless vocal renditions about the hapless bird.

I have just one 4-letter word for you – TEAM. Had the rubric read “to reveal a TEAM” rather than “to reveal a group” I would have got there much faster! (If you didn’t write it then please ignore the comment.)

To sum up, a fabulous puzzle, full of thematic interest, fun, challenging, frustrating at times, with a great ending. Thanks Seps, hope your next one is on its way.

*for the ancient mariner, not for Gene Sarazen, clearly

No completed crossword this time – in haste I posted it without scanning first!

Posted in Solving Blogs | Leave a Comment »

Southern Course by Seps

Posted by shirleycurran on 3 May 2024

It is only just over three months since we met Seps so we immediately suspect that this crossword must be date-related to be appearing so soon after his first. Solving speeds ahead but we have two thirds of the grid filled with no thematic event leaping out at us.

Obviously Seps earned his entry to the Listener Oenophiles at the end of December but I check anyway and find just a little evidence that he retains it, ‘Sobering cry when double returned (4)’ We decide that the misprinted letter must be an A (a ‘Sabering cry’ SA SA, when AS is returned twice). Well that double will suffice. Cheers, Seps.

All those golf terms! We are convinced there has to be a golf theme here but GSTAAD comes out of the first clue, ‘Augusta University always leaves sadly deserted resort with slopes in a breeze (6)’ We take ‘all’ the Us out of Augusta, anagram it (sadly) and add the D for deserted to get one of our ski resorts (Freeze, for Breeze). But isn’t Augusta the scene of the golf Masters, not Gstaad? The penny doesn’t drop yet!

STOPPETH ONE OF THREE! At last a little light dawns and I am able to tweeze out SHOT AN ALBATROSS and that GANNET recalls the Monty Python sketch. Now I realize why ‘Chuck club breaking off head (4)’ gives [S]TICK (with chEck for chUck). The Gannet on a stick! We see where the three ‘normal’ clues have to be altered and extract a letter from MOUNT, PYOT and HORN to give us MONTY PYTHON.

FAMOUSLY SHOT AN ALBATROSS. I haven’t a clue who did (apart from Coleridge’s sad seaman) but I can see where ANCIENT MARINER will fit into the grid and I back-solve to see GENE SARAZEN. Wiki confirms that he was a famous golfer who shot an albatross at the Masters in Augusta in 1935. How thematically rich this compilation was. I’m told, too, that the Masters is just beginning. Thank you Seps.

Posted in Solving Blogs | Leave a Comment »